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Offline saviilsy  
#1 Posted : Friday, August 26, 2011 10:39:11 AM(UTC)
saviilsy

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Hello!

A quick note at start : Beta seems to compile fine and most of the tests work, yet every one with animated texture/model or dynamic model does not work. Either texture is missing, model is missing or something (renders a "grid"). Same goes for UI stuff, I get error from FileCopy(or similar) function that the required DLLis already in use and crash. Are these things fixed in the next beta release?

Now to the point :

How to create an object at runtime, define vertices, normals, texcoords and colors?

And the scenegraph : is there a ready to use scenegraph base that transforms the child matrices when parent is changed? If not - is there a class that interfaces directly to graphics driver for push/pop matrix function or must we calculate the transformations in the cpu?

Thanks, keep up the good work :)
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Offline Benjamin  
#2 Posted : Friday, August 26, 2011 11:07:07 PM(UTC)
Benjamin

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Hi Santtu,

Originally Posted by: Santtu Syrjä Go to Quoted Post
A quick note at start : Beta seems to compile fine and most of the tests work, yet every one with animated texture/model or dynamic model does not work. Either texture is missing, model is missing or something (renders a "grid"). Same goes for UI stuff, I get error from FileCopy(or similar) function that the required DLLis already in use and crash. Are these things fixed in the next beta release?


This means you have to recompile, just to be sure clean your solution (this will delete all dlls in the bin folders) and rebuild everything. This gets rid of the error. I already fixed it after testing v0.8.6.1, but I did not want to build another patch already. In v0.8.7 this problem is gone and not longer a warning, just an info message that you should recompile.

Originally Posted by: Santtu Syrjä Go to Quoted Post
How to create an object at runtime, define vertices, normals, texcoords and colors?


Check out the GeometryHelper class in Delta.Rendering.Models, plus there is some functionality already in GeometryData in Delta.ContentSystem.Rendering.
Defining vertices is different, but very easy to do. You just define a VertexFormat (also in Delta.ContentSystem.Rendering) and use it when creating the Geometry. You can fill data with the helper methods in GeometryData, load from disk or do some own code for even better performance (directly write out a byte stream, see GeometryData on how that works).

In the future we will definitely have more tutorials about this available.

Originally Posted by: Santtu Syrjä Go to Quoted Post

And the scenegraph : is there a ready to use scenegraph base that transforms the child matrices when parent is changed? If not - is there a class that interfaces directly to graphics driver for push/pop matrix function or must we calculate the transformations in the cpu?


Not sure what you mean. For animated models (or cameras or whatever) you can use the Animation and Bone classes in Delta.ContentSystem.Rendering, but we don't have much in Delta.Engine.Game yet for advanced level handling, actors or scene graphs. Currently all game teams use their own code and we will try to find a good solution later.
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thanks 1 user thanked Benjamin for this useful post.
saviilsy on 8/27/2011(UTC)
Offline saviilsy  
#3 Posted : Saturday, August 27, 2011 1:53:06 PM(UTC)
saviilsy

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Hi Benjamin!

I updated to newest version.

Originally Posted by: Benjamin Nitschke Go to Quoted Post
Hi Santtu,

Originally Posted by: Santtu Syrjä Go to Quoted Post
A quick note at start : Beta seems to compile fine and most of the tests work, yet every one with animated texture/model or dynamic model does not work. Either texture is missing, model is missing or something (renders a "grid"). Same goes for UI stuff, I get error from FileCopy(or similar) function that the required DLLis already in use and crash. Are these things fixed in the next beta release?


This means you have to recompile, just to be sure clean your solution (this will delete all dlls in the bin folders) and rebuild everything. This gets rid of the error. I already fixed it after testing v0.8.6.1, but I did not want to build another patch already. In v0.8.7 this problem is gone and not longer a warning, just an info message that you should recompile.


Now majority of the tests works, no compile errors - thanks! However Block game is just white screen and other tutorial games give NullReferenceError -> Music.Play -> Program.cs (line 92).

Originally Posted by: Benjamin Nitschke Go to Quoted Post

Originally Posted by: Santtu Syrjä Go to Quoted Post
How to create an object at runtime, define vertices, normals, texcoords and colors?


Check out the GeometryHelper class in Delta.Rendering.Models, plus there is some functionality already in GeometryData in Delta.ContentSystem.Rendering.
Defining vertices is different, but very easy to do. You just define a VertexFormat (also in Delta.ContentSystem.Rendering) and use it when creating the Geometry. You can fill data with the helper methods in GeometryData, load from disk or do some own code for even better performance (directly write out a byte stream, see GeometryData on how that works).

In the future we will definitely have more tutorials about this available.


Thanks for the information, the now-working-tests also give a lot of help in this matter, now I can start porting my code to DE :)

Originally Posted by: Benjamin Nitschke Go to Quoted Post

Originally Posted by: Santtu Syrjä Go to Quoted Post

And the scenegraph : is there a ready to use scenegraph base that transforms the child matrices when parent is changed? If not - is there a class that interfaces directly to graphics driver for push/pop matrix function or must we calculate the transformations in the cpu?


Not sure what you mean. For animated models (or cameras or whatever) you can use the Animation and Bone classes in Delta.ContentSystem.Rendering, but we don't have much in Delta.Engine.Game yet for advanced level handling, actors or scene graphs. Currently all game teams use their own code and we will try to find a good solution later.


I meant a basic ummm... hierarchical node tree. I have a planet which is a root, moons which are children and when I scale/rotate/move the planet, moons reflect to this change so they scale/rotate/move too. You obviously have one in DE because You have models with skeletal structure(or do you ;).

I could easily create own hierarchical node tree, but I need the main interface to the abstracted graphics system where I can push and pop node matrices(access to the matrix stack). I didn't found one yet. You can think of opengl's glPush-/Mult/Pop-Matrix hell :)

I can do this in .net of course, but I bet if one can use the graphics card it is a lot faster.
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Offline Benjamin  
#4 Posted : Saturday, August 27, 2011 3:11:58 PM(UTC)
Benjamin

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Originally Posted by: Santtu Syrjä Go to Quoted Post

Now majority of the tests works, no compile errors - thanks! However Block game is just white screen and other tutorial games give NullReferenceError -> Music.Play -> Program.cs (line 92).


Sounds bad, reported as a bug. Can you try to delete your \bin\Debug folder and try recompiling and restarting the Blocks game (preferably without the SampleBrowser) to see if it works then. I guess your content is outdated or something is missing for music playback. You can also just comment out that Music.Play line and see if the rest works fine.

Originally Posted by: Santtu Syrjä Go to Quoted Post

I meant a basic ummm... hierarchical node tree. I have a planet which is a root, moons which are children and when I scale/rotate/move the planet, moons reflect to this change so they scale/rotate/move too. You obviously have one in DE because You have models with skeletal structure(or do you ;).

I could easily create own hierarchical node tree, but I need the main interface to the abstracted graphics system where I can push and pop node matrices(access to the matrix stack). I didn't found one yet. You can think of opengl's glPush-/Mult/Pop-Matrix hell :)

I can do this in .net of course, but I bet if one can use the graphics card it is a lot faster.


Should be easy enough to add yourself. Actors could be used this way and can have children, which would inherit the scale/rotate/move matrix stuff. We already have all this for the Scenes and whole UI, so I guess it would be not much work to test it with Actors and provide some basic classes for this functionality.

Obviously you can also roll your own system, should be easy enough as you said :)
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Offline saviilsy  
#5 Posted : Saturday, August 27, 2011 9:24:04 PM(UTC)
saviilsy

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Originally Posted by: Benjamin Nitschke Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Santtu Syrjä Go to Quoted Post

Now majority of the tests works, no compile errors - thanks! However Block game is just white screen and other tutorial games give NullReferenceError -> Music.Play -> Program.cs (line 92).


Sounds bad, reported as a bug. Can you try to delete your \bin\Debug folder and try recompiling and restarting the Blocks game (preferably without the SampleBrowser) to see if it works then. I guess your content is outdated or something is missing for music playback. You can also just comment out that Music.Play line and see if the rest works fine.


Deleting the bin/debug seemed to work on all sample games. Now they work perfectly.

Originally Posted by: Benjamin Nitschke Go to Quoted Post

Originally Posted by: Santtu Syrjä Go to Quoted Post

I meant a basic ummm... hierarchical node tree. I have a planet which is a root, moons which are children and when I scale/rotate/move the planet, moons reflect to this change so they scale/rotate/move too. You obviously have one in DE because You have models with skeletal structure(or do you ;).

I could easily create own hierarchical node tree, but I need the main interface to the abstracted graphics system where I can push and pop node matrices(access to the matrix stack). I didn't found one yet. You can think of opengl's glPush-/Mult/Pop-Matrix hell :)

I can do this in .net of course, but I bet if one can use the graphics card it is a lot faster.


Should be easy enough to add yourself. Actors could be used this way and can have children, which would inherit the scale/rotate/move matrix stuff. We already have all this for the Scenes and whole UI, so I guess it would be not much work to test it with Actors and provide some basic classes for this functionality.

Obviously you can also roll your own system, should be easy enough as you said :)


Does the actor already support this? Could not find any child/parent things in the documentation - or did You mean that I should modify/subclass the Actor class?
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Offline Benjamin  
#6 Posted : Monday, August 29, 2011 3:20:03 PM(UTC)
Benjamin

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To be honest we have not used the Actor classes since ZombieParty last year. All of the game teams wrote their own Actor classes (mostly based on Delta.Engine.Game, but still all their own code) and have very different features depending on the game. We have not spend much time merging those features back, so what you see in the Actor class is very outdated.

I just wrote down a feature request for v0.9.0 to update this a little, but you can also help us out if you want to :)
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Offline saviilsy  
#7 Posted : Tuesday, August 30, 2011 7:24:25 PM(UTC)
saviilsy

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I'll gladly help when I get the engine to run without any errors, should be hard to do a basic yet expandable scenegraph. although I noticed that cameras will need a wrapper class and emitters(effects) etc won't work straight away as I cannot control when the particles are drawn (or can I??? Cool ).
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