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Offline Michael Koch  
#1 Posted : Sunday, January 12, 2014 5:07:24 PM(UTC)
Michael Koch

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Hi there,

again a "playing around and getting a grip on things" question:

I was trying to outsource some common functions of a DE project into a subproject (ref by project or by dll; tried both). Thought it would be handy to have common (own) things reusable, e.g. a DE Gui window class as dll (might be provided to others some time later, too).

Is this supposed to be handled by the App Builder (now or in future)? So far, I got a Could not locate the assembly "MikoWeb.DeltaEngine.Window" error during remote build.

So, currently, making "re-usable components" means "source files shared between projects", right?

Thanks
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Offline Benjamin  
#2 Posted : Monday, January 13, 2014 2:20:25 PM(UTC)
Benjamin

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Yes, for your own code you would need to create a solution with the projects and use that in the AppBuilder. I guess it is a bug when the library is not picked up. Please write to Bugs@DeltaEngine.net if such things happen and a developer from the Platform Team can fix that issue.

Using an external library is the same except if we support it from our side (like any graphics or physics framework). If a common interface is used (like Physics3D) we are also able to replace one implementation with another (lets say Havok is used on Windows, but not available on Windows Phone, then it is replaced by something that works there).

If you can currently work with sharing source code files between projects, then do that, but obviously the library issue has to be fixed and then you can really build any project with any dependency as you like.
Offline internetfreak  
#3 Posted : Monday, January 13, 2014 3:04:44 PM(UTC)
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Because the topic is similar, I'm hanging me in here.
Will it later be possible to compile class libraries, for example I have some kind of cool framework build by myself and want to use it on Android.
I now could add another project in my solution and reference the projects directly so the AppBuilder can compile it. But imagine the point that I have a basic license and thus the right to compile for all platforms. I now want to compile my framework/toolkit for Android so I can give it to a friend which can then use it in his project. He just uploads the DLLs and sets the type to Android so the AppBuilder can use those libraries when building the project so the references are satisfied.
Will this be possible or what are your thoughts about that, if you already have some kind of brainstorming regarding that kind of situation?
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Offline Michael Koch  
#4 Posted : Monday, January 13, 2014 9:02:29 PM(UTC)
Michael Koch

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Good point, internetfreak! I'd like to second that question.

Don't know how the conversion in detail works. E.g., is byte code translated to JS for Web? Or is it more based on the C# source? If the latter one, maybe another AppBuilder option could be thought about: "Creation of Assembly". This way, we could create "dll-like" things even for the Web App. But I'm just guessing.

Maybe a far shot, but: Those "custom assemblies" could even trigger some sort of "3rd party addons" business - which might not be the case with someone being forced to provide "pure source" only...
Offline Benjamin  
#5 Posted : Tuesday, January 14, 2014 12:06:19 PM(UTC)
Benjamin

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Originally Posted by: internetfreak Go to Quoted Post
Because the topic is similar, I'm hanging me in here.
Will it later be possible to compile class libraries, for example I have some kind of cool framework build by myself and want to use it on Android.
I now could add another project in my solution and reference the projects directly so the AppBuilder can compile it. But imagine the point that I have a basic license and thus the right to compile for all platforms. I now want to compile my framework/toolkit for Android so I can give it to a friend which can then use it in his project. He just uploads the DLLs and sets the type to Android so the AppBuilder can use those libraries when building the project so the references are satisfied.
Will this be possible or what are your thoughts about that, if you already have some kind of brainstorming regarding that kind of situation?


Yes, as long as some code was converted, it can be reused. Some things are not plain conversions however and will require reconverting based on the implementations (e.g. entity related features), most of the time it should work out fine. Similar to content you would have to allow your friend or customer to use your project (let's say you just add them to your content project and they get access to your libraries as well, but obviously not to your source code, which is separately configurable).
Offline Benjamin  
#6 Posted : Tuesday, January 14, 2014 12:08:55 PM(UTC)
Benjamin

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Originally Posted by: miko93 Go to Quoted Post
Don't know how the conversion in detail works. E.g., is byte code translated to JS for Web? Or is it more based on the C# source? If the latter one, maybe another AppBuilder option could be thought about: "Creation of Assembly". This way, we could create "dll-like" things even for the Web App. But I'm just guessing.

Maybe a far shot, but: Those "custom assemblies" could even trigger some sort of "3rd party addons" business - which might not be the case with someone being forced to provide "pure source" only...


Depends on the platform. Platforms very similar to Windows like Windows 8 or Windows Phone or Xbox do in fact work very similar with solutions, projects and for testing we use Visual Studio as well. However Android and iOS are way different and code is converted to native C++, Objective-C and Java, which uses different tools and they all have different concepts of libraries. For Web Javascript is used, which is just a bunch of .js files, it has nothing to do with projects or dlls anymore. There is also no byte code, all code is completely converted from C# to JavaScript.
Offline Michael Koch  
#7 Posted : Tuesday, January 14, 2014 8:22:07 PM(UTC)
Michael Koch

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Ben, thanks for clarification.

Quote:
...let's say you just add them to your content project and they get access to your libraries as well, but obviously not to your source code, which is separately configurable)...


Yeah, could very well work with some online "lib store" or so, imho (and would also tie such services to the DE website, not easily being handled someplace else; not to mention easy updates by lib author, as most current lib version could be retrieved from online upon AppBuild).

You might want to put such "side business" ideas on the shelf, for possible later use (probably too early right now). After all, it will come down to create some revenue, too - and every bit helps Cool
Offline internetfreak  
#8 Posted : Tuesday, January 14, 2014 9:01:03 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Benjamin Nitschke Go to Quoted Post
Yes, as long as some code was converted, it can be reused. Some things are not plain conversions however and will require reconverting based on the implementations (e.g. entity related features), most of the time it should work out fine. Similar to content you would have to allow your friend or customer to use your project (let's say you just add them to your content project and they get access to your libraries as well, but obviously not to your source code, which is separately configurable).


Thanks for the clarification Benjamin. I have to admit that I didn't really understand something but I also have not really worked with the AppBuilder currently as I'm currently still in development and thus I didn't consider to test anything beside windows yet.
Maybe you can give me some more hints how it should be used?
If I understood it right, the compiled assemblies are still on the server, when I compile my project so I can give someone access to these assemblies?
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Offline Benjamin  
#9 Posted : Wednesday, January 15, 2014 12:18:26 PM(UTC)
Benjamin

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You can also download the compiled assemblies, in fact you get them anyway in your AppBuilder result (e.g. on Windows a bunch of .dll and .exe files inside the installer). They are not very useful though as they will most likely only work with your app.
Offline Judge  
#10 Posted : Wednesday, January 15, 2014 12:47:44 PM(UTC)
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Hi Miko,

I'm currentky checking out your bug report (thanks for it ThumpUp )
but unfortunately I currently can't reproduce your errors...

Could you maybe send me your source code ?

That would help me a lot to figure out what the problem is Smile .
Offline Michael Koch  
#11 Posted : Wednesday, January 15, 2014 10:12:11 PM(UTC)
Michael Koch

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Sure thing, Judge. FogBugz entry updated (2 links for download).
Should have attached the source right from the start, sorry.

For any additional info, just give me a shout...
Offline Judge  
#12 Posted : Thursday, January 16, 2014 2:06:26 PM(UTC)
Judge

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First thanks for providing your solution code.
So it was quite easy to figure out what the problem was and it should be fixed now Smile.

Unfortunately, you have to wait a bit until the current work at the updated BuildService is done.
This will probably take until the end of next week...

However, this doesn't mean that you can't check out the Nightly Release (which will come this evening or tomorrow)
where now also 3D is finally coming back Smile.

So long story short, everything can be used (incl. 3D content importing) except the BuildService.
Offline Michael Koch  
#13 Posted : Thursday, January 16, 2014 6:57:43 PM(UTC)
Michael Koch

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Nice one, Judge! Again, thanks.

No problem with the BuildService update scheduling - not at all.
Still got plenty of DE features on the list to dive in and learn/try out.
Haha, even more when 3D (YAY!) re-arrives...
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